Suggestion about making a really old school server

[SACRU]

I have the following suggestions:

1. Make a separate server that is ultra hard pvm, meaning lv 40 is AN ACHIEVEMENT, armed horse another big achievement.
- With mostly 2008 content, but with quality of like modifications - clearly without alchemy and other systems added just so that GameForge milk real money and just it.
- Normal 2008 drop, but with much higher blacksmith success rates than 2008/officials (I think this also is a milking method of GameForge - that asks for large amounts of Blessing Scrolls et co)
- Level up just as hard as 2008.
- Assassin and Shaman helmet gets consistant animal mob bonuses so that their pvm struggle be fairer/more acceptable.
- Remove Bravery Cape to remake Archer's value.
- Things that do not disturb the old school vibe, like offline whisper, shop search, anything that is good and do not ruin the said vibe.

2. Merge an already big oldschool server* into WOM2 and let it run inside WOM2 umbrella, basically being an alliance. I have a suggestion with the same name as the school (OldSchool; no, I do not have any personal link with the owners). That way you will not lose middle school WOM2 players when making a separate oldschool server, cause there already is a member base from the said merged server.

Please do any of the two options.

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* Big in the way an oldschool server can be big, given the oldschool lovers are not the majority, yet they matter and have needs.

 

[Yamamoto]

Hello SACRU,

1. WoM2 is already similar to what you describe, except there will be Alchemy. I understand not everyone likes this but it was voted on Discord and the majority wanted it.

As for the bravery cape, just like in the case of buffers, it is a lost battle to try forcing people into being social. On this topic, I may suggest watching this video:

2. Server owners are not very prone to forming alliances and merges. Everyone believs they can make it big on their own.

 

[SACRU]

Hello SACRU,

1. WoM2 is already similar to what you describe, except there will be Alchemy. I understand not everyone likes this but it was voted on Discord and the majority wanted it.

As for the bravery cape, just like in the case of buffers, it is a lost battle to try forcing people into being social. On this topic, I may suggest watching this video:

2. Server owners are not very prone to forming alliances and merges. Everyone believs they can make it big on their own.

No, it is not similar. Wom2 is muuuch easier from what I'm describing.

I understand it was voted (about Alchemy and anything alien to original Metin), but of course the majority was pro middleschool, BECAUSE* few people want this type of server, so of course they will not be the majority, but that does not mean that they do not deserve such a server, also one that is being made in a proficient manner, like WOM2 does.

It was not only about forcing people to be social, but about making Archer class MORE useful and valuable, as it initially was; nowadays the Archer became a beggar in this game, given the poor updates. The Archer class totally got thrown under the train after some years after 2008, all the items and updates literally ignored his needs or simply made him useless (bulletproof tier anti-arrow stuff), as well as totally eliminating a very good ninja role: making lures. It's like taking a good spell from other race/class and disqualifying, incapacitating that race/class. Or even better, it is like taking the buff out of Shamans. This is not fair. Of course only Archer loving people will notice this.

2. Maybe there is a way if it is a fair trade and if they are allowed to partially lead their project.

Thank you for attention and for your answers, no matter the answers.

--
* this is not yelling, just emphasizing

 

[Pachol]

Hello,
I think your suggestion is more about nostalgy and not exactly what you would like to play. Yes, we used to love metin from the early years, we had to learn the game, communicate with other players and group with them to achieve our goals. But you have to remember that we were kids, we could easily login after school (or skip school to play in special cases), then grind whole day.
Now players prefers fast-paced games, thus MMORPG are not that popular anymore, and same goes for metin, it's even worse for slow-pace servers that you describe. It only looks good on the paper and for the first two weeks max. then you get bored and leave. We could notice it already on metin2 scene of hardcore servers, some owners are trying bring those OldSchool vibes but they barely survival one month. Yes, they have some players, however, it's 50 max, which is not enough to sustain for the server.

Remember that metin2 is a business, you need a plan that will make hard sv lovers happy, but you need also something for medium sv lovers, that's why some QoLs and features were added, not to destroy the old-school vibe, and at the same point, not to discourage other players from playing.

Archer state is fair enough, making him your slave to lure mobs will not help.
I don't know how it is on this WoM2 but on the previous edition he was the best boss slayer and, in my opinion, the best oPvP char.

Leveling as in 2008? The difference is, on office servers we were not leveling with full geared chars and buffs, that is why it was much harder. Do not forget about leveling place, it was Red Wood with lv... 90 mobs? After introducing heaven's lair, people rushed with levels. Exp curve might be slightly changed here but it will be hard as well.

Best regards,
Pachol.

 

[SACRU]

Hello,
I think your suggestion is more about nostalgy and not exactly what you would like to play. Yes, we used to love metin from the early years, we had to learn the game, communicate with other players and group with them to achieve our goals. But you have to remember that we were kids, we could easily login after school (or skip school to play in special cases), then grind whole day.
Now players prefers fast-paced games, thus MMORPG are not that popular anymore, and same goes for metin, it's even worse for slow-pace servers that you describe. It only looks good on the paper and for the first two weeks max. then you get bored and leave. We could notice it already on metin2 scene of hardcore servers, some owners are trying bring those OldSchool vibes but they barely survival one month. Yes, they have some players, however, it's 50 max, which is not enough to sustain for the server.

Remember that metin2 is a business, you need a plan that will make hard sv lovers happy, but you need also something for medium sv lovers, that's why some QoLs and features were added, not to destroy the old-school vibe, and at the same point, not to discourage other players from playing.

Archer state is fair enough, making him your slave to lure mobs will not help.
I don't know how it is on this WoM2 but on the previous edition he was the best boss slayer and, in my opinion, the best oPvP char.

Leveling as in 2008? The difference is, on office servers we were not leveling with full geared chars and buffs, that is why it was much harder. Do not forget about leveling place, it was Red Wood with lv... 90 mobs? After introducing heaven's lair, people rushed with levels. Exp curve might be slightly changed here but it will be hard as well.

Best regards,
Pachol.

With respect, Wom2 may have been oldschool, but it is clearly middle school now and for some time, given it implemented almost anything Gameforge made. Gameforge is clealry not oldschool. Just cause some servers implemented pokemon-level and Wow-level alien content on their servers, it does not mean that those that do not have those alien circus are indeed oldschool.
It is normal to try to sustain the server, all workers need bread in the end, but we should distance as much as possible from Gameforge and his moneyhunger school.

It is not just about nostalgia, some NEED an oldschool server even if we are not the majority. We simply do not like fast paced servers or almost fast paced servers and we are in for hardcore stuff. And I say it as someone that could only play 2-4h per day, at best. I am all right with not being a pro and playing for fun in the full sense.

Yes, the Archer got robbed from an important role in which he could have been helped to level up, the Archer was thought in such a manner that it needs warrior/sura groups. The alternative is to work too hard or to have too good of an item set, which it was not the original thought of Archers, you do not need perfect items to level up as an Archer. But bravery capes stole it from him, this important role. Just like the machines replace real persons' work nowadays, a real person is denied salary and bread.

To see this Archer role as slavery, it is your optic, an optic that in reality harms Archers, the same way feminism harms families, good masculinity and women.

Repositioning on the topic: oldschool servers CAN survive IF protected by stronger umbrellas like WOM2. That is the idea I was pushing. And merging/making alliance would help implementing this idea WITHOUT losing players from the original WOM2 playerbase, the said merged server already having this separate playerbase.

AND, if players get bored of oldschool server, though I do not think it is the case for all people, not all get bored by oldschool; but IF this happens, they can start on the middleschool (original WOM2) server. And the reverso, some middleschool can try oldschool without exiting WOM2 umbrella. I see it as a win-win situation, just if the leaderships manage to collaborate fairly.

It ALSO helps Metin2 in general, united is better, stronger, longer, stable, steady. Separated is quite the opposite. But we also have to fulfill the needs of all, and middle school is not always a fulfilling thing for all, you cannot please all in the same server/game school.

 

[SACRU]

Hello SACRU,

1. WoM2 is already similar to what you describe, except there will be Alchemy. I understand not everyone likes this but it was voted on Discord and the majority wanted it.

As for the bravery cape, just like in the case of buffers, it is a lost battle to try forcing people into being social. On this topic, I may suggest watching this video:

2. Server owners are not very prone to forming alliances and merges. Everyone believs they can make it big on their own.

Yamamoto, about your 2. argument (about owners not agreeing), right now an oldschool server admin told me he would agree about this merging. I am talking about the server I play atm, though I do not have any personal links. I only reached both parties to try pushing my idea.​

 

[Pachol]

Wom2 may have been oldschool, but it is clearly middle school now

We don't know what a new WoM will be, but it's been said they are going for OldSchool type from 2014, we have to trust on what they said.

Gameforge is clealry not oldschool.

Of course it's, every game need a development aka updates or DLCs, otherwise community will get bored. No one would be interested to play the same metin for 15 years without any new content.

oldschool servers CAN survive IF protected by stronger umbrellas like WOM2

Do I need to explain what WoM2 Luna was? I think it was the best reality check for OldSchool server.

 

[SACRU]

We don't know what a new WoM will be, but it's been said they are going for OldSchool type from 2014, we have to trust on what they said.


Of course it's, every game need a development aka updates or DLCs, otherwise community will get bored. No one would be interested to play the same metin for 15 years without any new content.


Do I need to explain what WoM2 Luna was? I think it was the best reality check for OldSchool server.

I said it is not wrong to have quality of life content or tools that help, but that with limitation, so that you keep distance from Gameforge and non-oldschool stuff. Some things may be implemented, but not all.

And again, you are not oldschool if you are up to date to Gameforge content, the enemy of oldschool AND fair and peaceful gameplay.

 

[Pachol]

This is what WoM2 does, adding important QoLs and features, for me, they still keep the old-school vibe compared to other servers.
No sashes, no transmutation, mounts&costumes only as cosmetics, no special auras around chars, and so on...

 

[DeCiMaToR]

Honestly, while I can understand how people are longing for the old times, I think it is undeniable that they are not being realistic.
As Pachol already stated, we are not clueless teenagers anymore, that are learning the game and don't know anything.
A true oldschool server is only good for a few days/weeks of nostalgia until it becomes unbearingly boring. Also, the limited content really kills motivation in the long run.
Either you make the oldschool server really SUPER hard, like back in the day only being able to give in bios or read books once a day, to limit the progression --> super boring.
Or you bring in some QoL and allow a little faster pace so it is not as boring and more dynamic --> People will reach the end quickly and get bored.

I loved WoM for what it is. A super nice balance between a hard oldschool server, where good bonuses mean something, being happy about finding metins and obtaining rare items etc., while also being innovative with new content, so that you always have motivation to play.
New content like alchemy, new maps, new gear etc. does not just not make a server bad, it is actually mandatory to have a fun and long running server, in my eyes.
The hard part here is to achieve a good balance with these systems and content, but when it is done well, it is adding so much to the server experience.
The reason why alchemy is hated so much, is simply because it is completely unbalanced on official, and just a huge pain /close to impossible to get, while also throwing everything else off balance.
I loved alchemy on WoM, as it was just more content to work for, and it was of course helping you (as it should), but was not throwing everything else off balance, while also being obtainable (CL1) and having a high cap (CL5 being super expensive) simultaneously.

Anyway, the "Oldschool" aspect in my eyes should be more of a guideline, in terms of harder progression, not having infinite changers etc, but it should not limit the amount of content necessarily. Sticking too closely to these definitions will just limit the experience.

I really don't mean any disrespect here, but I just think you are simply looking for another server to satisfy some nostalgia. But that is just not WoM.